GC: Why is there more focus on trans women than trans men?

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[–]SnowAssMan 8 insightful - 1 fun8 insightful - 0 fun9 insightful - 1 fun -  (20 children)

Presentism. Transgender as a concept describing a type of woman rather than a type of man is a modern, Western trend. It wasn't that long ago we were describing all the people in various cultures, who we now call "women", as gay men. The hijra in India & the kathoey in Thailand are literally homosexuals. The trans movement is attempting to erase & appropriate them in order to legitimise its ideology.

I'll give you an example: "Two Spirit" is a modern Western word & describes supposed transgender Native Americans. The old word was "berdache", which literally means, you guessed it: passive homosexual. In those days, in those nations, if you were gay, it was more than likely that you were "the only gay in the village". The only way you could have a same-sex marriage would be to take on the gender roles of the opposite sex. That's why homosexuality manifests itself this same way in all these isolated ethnic minority groups, all over the world. This is gay history, now being erased by trans hysteria. And people like you are complicit:

“As far as the sexual orientation of hijra people is cocnerned Hossain (2012) who conducted an ethnogrpahic research in Bangladesh stated that sexually and romantically hijra people are attracted towards “macho” men (Hossain 2012, 495)”

“Thailand’s third-gender kathoey also deviate from the conventional sex and gender binary models. Generally, the kathoey are perceived as feminine males who are sexually inclined toward men (Grünhagen 2016, 224-225)”

“In terms of sexual orientation, male berdache were generally inclined toward non-berdache men (Roscoe 1996, 335)”

“Jainism also demonstrates a historical understanding of gender nonconformity. The Jain community interpreted gender-variance through a unique lens, where one’s role during intercourse determined one’s gender identity (Reddy, 2005)”

“The māhū of Hawaii and other Pacific Islands, similarly possess feminine gender characteristics and engage in intercourse with male chiefs. During the encounter, the māhū is penetrated and adopts the sexual roles of a woman. That said, māhūs are not generally seen as women, but rather as replacements for women. A sexual relationship with a māhū is considered convenient, pleasurable, and a relatively pressure-free engagement (Besnier 1996, 301)”

https://d-nb.info/1202848060/34

You think it mere chance that all these supposedly transgendered people are all homosexuals? Chance would never allow for such a coincidence.

Oh, & women living as men are not transgender. If a woman lives as a man, does that make her a man? Can a woman not live as a man then, since it automatically makes her a man? It's like if you're black but you passed for white in the olden days you could "live as white". That doesn't make them "trans-racial", right? The only way women could do the same things that men could in the olden days was for them to pass as men.

The slurs I listed are used mostly by women on Ovarit.

You failed to list a single slur. Again an insult is not the same as a slur. 'Narcissist' is not the same as the n-word. Didn't know that needed explaining.

You: Caitlyn Jenner's natally, born, biologically, assumed, bimodal, assigned, constructed, at birth sex, without even asking(!) is male”.

Also You: Caitlyn Jenner is female.

Sexist double-standard. Sex is male & female. Gender is masculine & feminine. Quit being complicit in the trans movement's appropriation of sex terms to refer to social constructs. Transgendered adult human males become more aggressive if you acknowledge their sex instead of their self-id. Like that one who threatened Ben Shapiro. That's why we need to separate them from women, because they can, at any time, self-identify right back into the role they were socialised into.

No one said that people with DSDs invented the term, dumbass. Are you claiming trans people invented it? lol try finding evidence of that. Sex is only assigned in the case of intersex people.

Not every girl wanted to be an emo either. It's a teenage subculture. Older women, women who have given birth seem to not be trans. How do you explain the sudden explosion in trans numbers within the demographic of young het girls? If it's not social contagion then it's biologically determined. Can you cough up any evidence that their biology is different from girls in the past & that this is what's causing it?

Anyone with a healthy male body would just live with it. They wouldn't try to transition, unless they were suffering from some sort of trauma, self-hatred, or some other mental issue, hence why the vast majority desist. They grow out of it. You would too.

Detransition is rare

lol you don't even know the difference between desistance & detransition. Every gender realist is an ignoramus, otherwise they'd be GC. Btw, detransition may be rare, but it's not as rare as suicide. How do you justify transition with a minuscule suicide rate, while a higher detrans rate can't shift you into rejecting medical transition as necessary or even viable as an option? It's that hypocritical double standard again, isn't it? Whatever can be implied to affirm self-id is paramount & whatever undermines it is insignificant – the mantra of the self-id cult.

ICD is for diseases. Transgender is not a disease.

You're the one calling them dysphoric i.e. mentally disordered. Neither the DSM nor the ICD lists being transgender as a disease or mental disorder btw. They list them at all so that they can justify mutilating them "for their own good". It's an indirect way of pathologising homosexuality.

[–]GenderbenderShe/her/hers[S] 1 insightful - 6 fun1 insightful - 5 fun2 insightful - 6 fun -  (19 children)

Presentism. Transgender as a concept describing a type of woman rather than a type of man is a modern, Western trend.

Transgender can both describe men and women. There are trans men and there are trans women.

It wasn't that long ago we were describing all the people in various cultures, who we now call "women", as gay men. The hijra in India & the kathoey in Thailand are literally homosexuals.

And some are transsexuals and that's OK.

Oh, & women living as men are not transgender. If a woman lives as a man, does that make her a man?

Then they're not living as men then.

You failed to list a single slur. Again an insult is not the same as a slur. 'Narcissist' is not the same as the n-word. Didn't know that needed explaining.

A slur, according to Merriam-Websiter is an insulting or disparaging remark or innuendo : aspersion..

Sexist double-standard. Sex is male & female. Gender is masculine & feminine. Quit being complicit in the trans movement's appropriation of sex terms to refer to social constructs.

I personally don't mind the term male and female to be used for identities. I also don't mind them being used in a biological sense when we talk about medicine and biology.

No one said that people with DSDs invented the term, dumbass. Are you claiming trans people invented it? lol try finding evidence of that. Sex is only assigned in the case of intersex people.

Yes but we use the term "assigned sex at birth" for birth sex.

Not every girl wanted to be an emo either. It's a teenage subculture.

Being trans is not a subculture.

Anyone with a healthy male body would just live with it. They wouldn't try to transition, unless they were suffering from some sort of trauma, self-hatred, or some other mental issue, hence why the vast majority desist. They grow out of it. You would too.

This is proof that GCs don't believe in dysphoria.

lol you don't even know the difference between desistance & detransition.

To my understanding, detransitioning is to reverse medical transition while desisting is to stop identifying as trans. All desisters are detransitioners but not all detransitioners are desisters. I cited a source that detransition is rare.

[–]SnowAssMan 7 insightful - 1 fun7 insightful - 0 fun8 insightful - 1 fun -  (18 children)

Transgender can both describe men and women. There are trans men and there are trans women.

Hijra & kathoey are all the same sex, dumbass.

Wait, you only think some hijra & kathoey are transsexuals? Transsexual is a type of gay man, not a type of woman. There is no evidence to the contrary.

White-passing black people who "live as white people" aren't "living as white people" then? If you're gay, but you're "living as straight" are you straight? A woman living as a man is a woman living as a man, not an adult human male. Masculinity & femininity ae constructs, not "man" & "woman".

A regular-ass insult is not a "transphobic slur", since anyone can be a narcissist. Playing dumb makes you look stupid.

You: "I personally don't mind sexist erasure & appropriation of language" – irrelevant.

birth sex

Sex doesn't change. It started before birth & continues after birth & continues even beyond death. So the term "birth sex" is meaningless. What's the difference between a person's sex & their "birth sex"? What's Caitlyn Jenner's sex? Male. What's his "birth sex"? Male. What's the point of the "birth" part?

Being trans is not a subculture.

Het teenagers have made it into one, hence 2% of high-schoolers identifying as trans nowadays. While there don't seem to be any older women doing it.

This is proof that GCs don't believe in dysphoria.

Neither does the icd-11. You don't believe in it either, remember? You don't think being trans is a mental disorder, remember? While the DSM is on the fence about it.

Every study on desistance (not detransition) illustrates that the vast majority desist. Detransition is rare, but not as rare as suicide, the latter we're meant to be taking seriously for some reason, even though the rate isn't even known (since corpses only have a sex, not a preferred sex).

[–]GenderbenderShe/her/hers[S] 1 insightful - 6 fun1 insightful - 5 fun2 insightful - 6 fun -  (17 children)

Wait, you only think some hijra & kathoey are transsexuals? Transsexual is a type of gay man, not a type of woman. There is no evidence to the contrary.

Transsexual can describe both women and men. Trans women who are attracted to men would by definition be straight women, and if they are attracted to other women they are lesbians. Trans men who are attracted to women are straight, and those who are attracted to other men they are gay men.

White-passing black people who "live as white people" aren't "living as white people" then? If you're gay, but you're "living as straight" are you straight? A woman living as a man is a woman living as a man, not an adult human male. Masculinity & femininity ae constructs, not "man" & "woman".

Trans men aren't women, so they would be men living as men not women living as men.

A regular-ass insult is not a "transphobic slur", since anyone can be a narcissist. Playing dumb makes you look stupid.

But GCs misuse the term narcissist for at least 75% of the trans population. Learn the criteria for NPD before throwing around that term.

Sex doesn't change. It started before birth & continues after birth & continues even beyond death. So the term "birth sex" is meaningless. What's the difference between a person's sex & their "birth sex"? What's Caitlyn Jenner's sex? Male. What's his "birth sex"? Male. What's the point of the "birth" part?

Birth sex is a more clearer term. Some sex characteristics (not all though) can be altered.

Het teenagers have made it into one, hence 2% of high-schoolers identifying as trans nowadays. While there don't seem to be any older women doing it.

Elliot Page and Buck Angel don't exist then?

Neither does the icd-11.

I don't care about the icd-11.

[–]SnowAssMan 7 insightful - 2 fun7 insightful - 1 fun8 insightful - 2 fun -  (16 children)

Your only defence is to be deliberately obtuse. A heterosexual man who identifies as a woman is by definition an autogynaephile. People who call the female ones transsexuals are trying to be inclusive. A transsexual, outside the paraphilia-ridden West, is a gay man.

Women are capable of doing all the same things men are capable of. A woman "living as a man" just means her role has changed to a masculine one. A man isn't a role. A man is an adult human male. Was Michael Jackson white, but "assigned black at birth"?

No, GCs don't misuse the word 'narcissist'. Have you ever listed to one of those male pretend-women? It's like, are you talking to me, or your reflection?

The term "birth sex" fools trans people into thinking there is a chance of changing it. The whole point of being transgender is that your sex & preferred-sex are mismatched. The terms "sex" vs. "preferred-sex" couldn't make it clearer. It's never about being clearer when it comes to trans terms, it's always about undermining sex as much as possible in order to affirm self-identification with a construct as supreme.

Transtrenderism describes a teenage sub-culture fuelled by trans identities, instead of star signs, or whatever. Statistical outliers are insignificant when talking about trends.

The icd-11 > your opinion. Gender dysphoria is an old, out-dated concept that is on its way out, which is why you still believe it's biologically determined, while GC knows that autogynaephiles aren't born that way, otherwise they'd exist outside the West.

[–]GenderbenderShe/her/hers[S] 2 insightful - 6 fun2 insightful - 5 fun3 insightful - 6 fun -  (15 children)

Your only defence is to be deliberately obtuse. A heterosexual man who identifies as a woman is by definition an autogynaephile. People who call the female ones transsexuals are trying to be inclusive.

Most trans people are not autogynephilic and autoandrophilic, unless you're a die-hard Blanchardian.

A transsexual, outside the paraphilia-ridden West, is a gay man.

It's insulting to call gay men transsexual. Gay men are gay men.

Women are capable of doing all the same things men are capable of.

I never said they weren't.

A woman "living as a man" just means her role has changed to a masculine one.

I like things that are considered stereotypically male (i.e. handy-work). Am I "living as a man" now?

No, GCs don't misuse the word 'narcissist'. Have you ever listed to one of those male pretend-women? It's like, are you talking to me, or your reflection?

I have listened to actual trans women. Do you know what criteria for NPD is? Actual narcissists are very charming, and they use that charm to victimize others. They have a grandiose sense of self-importance and are preoccupied with fantasies of unlimited success, power, brilliance, beauty, or ideal love. Someone who just has an awful and selfish personality is not a narcissist. Paolo Macchiarini is an example of a narcissist. He's very charming, can't take criticism, needs attention and admiration, exaggerates his achievements and talents and is arrogant.

https://www.mayoclinic.org/diseases-conditions/narcissistic-personality-disorder/symptoms-causes/syc-20366662

Transtrenderism describes a teenage sub-culture fuelled by trans identities, instead of star signs, or whatever. Statistical outliers are insignificant when talking about trends.

Trans isn't a trend because by definition trends don't last long. If transgenderism was a trend, we wouldn't need gender critical.

[–]SnowAssMan 8 insightful - 1 fun8 insightful - 0 fun9 insightful - 1 fun -  (14 children)

The majority of male transsexuals are autogynaephiles (in the West). It's not just "Blanchardian", since the term can be found in the trans bible: the DSM-V. So there is a consensus on the typology.

It's insulting to call gay men transsexual. Gay men are gay men.

Homosexuals have a different name in every culture. You view them as women for some reason, which is more than merely insulting to both women & gay men, since any threat to their definitions threaten their rights. "Transsexual" is just the term that groups autogynaephiles & homosexuals with a feminine gender-role preference together.

I like things that are considered stereotypically male (i.e. handy-work). Am I "living as a man" now?

No, you've got to basically try to pass as a man in order to "live as a man". The act of living as a man doesn't turn a woman into a man though. Those women just wanted the freedom to do the kinds of things men could. They are basically in disguise. Identity crisis as a result would probably not be uncommon. Most people go through a mini-identity crisis during puberty & at the mid-life point.

So first narcissist was a "transphobic slur", now it's just misused term. So they are using a term you don't find 100% accurate. And?

Trans isn't a trend because by definition trends don't last long. If transgenderism was a trend, we wouldn't need gender critical.

Transtrenderism is a trend within the demographic that has a weakness for such things: teen girls. This is a trend as it is limited to a particular time & place. Autogynaephiles are limited to a particular place, while the homosexuals who adopt the gender role of the opposite sex are found all over the world & throughout history. That's one of the reasons we know the trans movement has the wrong interpretation.

Personally, I used to think that all these men who self-identified as women were women. But then I started listening to both sides more (more to the trans side). There is no evidence to support the ridiculous "TWAW" claim, but plenty of evidence against it. Figuring out that men who are men by both nature & nurture are men & not women, is not due to hatred. I only "hate" them as much as I hate any other relentlessly, dogmatic sexist homophobe who silences feminist discourse.

[–]GenderbenderShe/her/hers[S] 1 insightful - 6 fun1 insightful - 5 fun2 insightful - 6 fun -  (13 children)

The majority of male transsexuals are autogynaephiles (in the West).

Nope.

It's not just "Blanchardian", since the term can be found in the trans bible: the DSM-V. So there is a consensus on the typology.

The DSM-V is not a trans bible.

Homosexuals have a different name in every culture. You view them as women for some reason, which is more than merely insulting to both women & gay men, since any threat to their definitions threaten their rights. "Transsexual" is just the term that groups autogynaephiles & homosexuals with a feminine gender-role preference together.

A homosexual is someone who is attracted to the same gender. A transsexual, or transgender is someone who identifies with a gender that is different from the one they were assigned at birth. Those are different terms.

Those women just wanted the freedom to do the kinds of things men could. They are basically in disguise.

Trans men are not "women in disguise".

So first narcissist was a "transphobic slur", now it's just misused term. So they are using a term you don't find 100% accurate. And?

Most of the time it is inaccurate.

Transtrenderism is a trend within the demographic that has a weakness for such things: teen girls. This is a trend as it is limited to a particular time & place.

Here are a list trans people from the 18th, 19th and 20th centuries. Eleanor Rykener, Alan L. Hart, Lucy Hicks Anderson, Amelio Robles Ávila, Sir Lady Java, Willmer ‘Little Ax” Broadnax, Chevalier d’Eon, Harry Allen, Michael Dillon and Charley Parkhurst.

Even today, people continue to transition as adults. Elliot Page is in his 30s and recently came out. Buck Angel is in his 50s and still identifies as a man. Luke Anderson, the Big Brother winner was born in South Africa, is 40 and a trans man.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_transgender_people

[–]SnowAssMan 6 insightful - 1 fun6 insightful - 0 fun7 insightful - 1 fun -  (12 children)

Nope

Yep: https://transequality.org/sites/default/files/docs/usts/USTS%20Full%20Report%20-%20FINAL%201.6.17.pdf

The DSM-V is not a trans bible.

It's where your belief in gender dysphoria stems from.

A transsexual, or transgender is someone who identifies with a gender that is different from the one they were assigned at birth.

A homosexual is someone who is attracted to the same sex. So now it was their gender that was "assigned at birth", no longer their sex? Or are sex & gender the same thing now? "A transgender"? "Transgender" is an adjective. I've never seen such hypocritical pedantry.

Trans men are not "women in disguise".

Then we agree that they never used to exist until very recently.

Most of the time it is inaccurate.

Cry me a river.

Transing dead people is not the least bit convincing. It's called SELF-identification for a reason. You're breaking your own rules by making presumptions about them.

I know you're obsessed with erasing sexual orientation, but Elliot Page, Buck Angel & Luke Anderson are all homosexuals. How many times have I told you that the transtrenders are the het girl demographic? You know, the demographic covered by Lisa Littman's studies & Abigail Shrier's book. Why didn't you name Demi Lovato? Oh right, I was forgetting the gender police always ironically discriminate against non-binary people.

[–]GenderbenderShe/her/hers[S] 1 insightful - 6 fun1 insightful - 5 fun2 insightful - 6 fun -  (11 children)

Yep: https://transequality.org/sites/default/files/docs/usts/USTS%20Full%20Report%20-%20FINAL%201.6.17.pdf

Your own link doesn't mention autogynephilia or autoandrophilia.

It's where your belief in gender dysphoria stems from.

I would believe in gender dysphoria even without the DSM.

A homosexual is someone who is attracted to the same sex. So now it was their gender that was "assigned at birth", no longer their sex? Or are sex & gender the same thing now? "A transgender"? "Transgender" is an adjective. I've never seen such hypocritical pedantry.

A homosexual is soneone who is attracted to people of mainly the same sex characteristics as their own.

Then we agree that they never used to exist until very recently.

I keep pointing out trans men in history yet you still claim trans men only existed recently.

Transing dead people is not the least bit convincing. It's called SELF-identification for a reason. You're breaking your own rules by making presumptions about them.

All the trans people I listed self-identified as trans.

I know you're obsessed with erasing sexual orientation, but Elliot Page, Buck Angel & Luke Anderson are all homosexuals.

Nope. They're straight.

How many times have I told you that the transtrenders are the het girl demographic? You know, the demographic covered by Lisa Littman's studies & Abigail Shrier's book. Why didn't you name Demi Lovato? Oh right, I was forgetting the gender police always ironically discriminate against non-binary people.

When you keep being presented with proof to the contrary, you still claim transgenders are mostly the het teenage girl demographic of the 21st century. Yes, Demi Lovato also identifies as non-binary and she's 28.