Both: Do "transbians" exist outside the West?

submitted by SnowAssMan from self.GCdebatesQT

sorted by:
top
newinsightfulfun
you are viewing a single comment's thread.

view the rest of the comments →

[–]SnowAssMan[S] 6 insightful - 1 fun6 insightful - 0 fun7 insightful - 1 fun -  (2 children)

every time you refer to homosexuals with cross-gender roles as "women" you're surely doing very much the same as calling them "not real men", hypocrite.

so trans people never existed before the 20th century & don't exist in most countries of the world even today just because boob implants haven't existed until then? Is being trans a medical condition except you acquire by trying to treat it in some sort of mad pathologising paradox?

When are you going to admit I was right & you were wrong about kathoeys' sexual orientation btw?

If there is no evidence of something ever existing until 10 years ago, it's pretty safe to assume that it's not natural, like the recent trend of non-binary teenage girls, for instance. Cultural imperialism is a thing FYI. Over time cultures become more homogeneous by assimilating to the dominant culture. Skin-whitening beauty products in various cultures are a direct result of colonialism & imperialism, & if ever there is a shift in the kathoey's sexual orientation distribution to include a bunch of "transbians" then it'd be just as safe to assume it was entirely due to Western influence. Only evolutionary biologists use logic flawed by presentism. Are you an evolutionary biologist?

Brain studies? What brain studies? The ones that prove gay men are women on account of not all gay brains having one tiny similarity in common with not all female brains? Cherry picking. Brain studies more often than not prove the exact opposite of what you're looking for, unless you're so selective you end up cherry-picking the bits you like & discarding the majority you don't like. You said yourself that Thailand has a homophobic history, in addition to that we know that it has one of the highest trans populations & they are practically all same-sex attracted – it's not far-fetched at all to make the case that transgenderism is an outgrowth of systemic homophobia. It doesn't take a genius to put two & two together, just the most rudimentary critical thinking skills.

You're really grasping at straws at this point. It's quite pathetic really. All the evidence points to transbians only existing in the West, produce evidence to the contrary Transgendered males are homosexuals assimilating to a homophobic culture, while transbianism is a paraphilia & nb is the product of a teen sub-culture, it's clear as day. What's the alternative? "Trapped in the wrong body", feel like this, live like that? Give me a break.

[–][deleted] 3 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 0 fun4 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

every time you refer to homosexuals with cross-gender roles as "women" you're surely doing very much the same as calling them "not real men", hypocrite.

That’s not what I’m doing. I separated the fafafine and the Kathoey that though of themselves as men from the discussion of women expressly.

so trans people never existed before the 20th century & don't exist in most countries of the world even today just because boob implants haven't existed until then?

It may shock you to learn that steps like removing testes could be taken before the 1930’s.

Is being trans a medical condition except you acquire by trying to treat it in some sort of mad pathologising paradox?

Gender dysphoria is a medical condition. When you treat it you become trans. They aren’t identical terms.

And you are using transbian wrong. The trans women who would say transbian instead of lesbian are looking for other trans women not natal women.

Brain studies? What brain studies?

The multiple studies that have demonstrated that trans women have particular structures separate from tendencies of men or natal women suggesting a biological basis for dysphoria. I don’t have them handy but I know there were at least 2.

You said yourself that Thailand has a homophobic history, in addition to that we know that it has one of the highest trans populations & they are practically all same-sex attracted – it's not far-fetched at all to make the case that transgenderism is an outgrowth of systemic homophobia. It doesn't take a genius to put two & two together, just the most rudimentary critical thinking skills.

Correlation doesn’t prove causation. You can posit the theory but there’s no data to show that it would follow that there would be no trans people without homophobia. In fact it’s at minimum put in doubt with the rising number of out trans people in America as gay rights are as advanced as they have ever been. Your theory would require the opposite.

All the evidence points to transbians only existing in the West,

Literally no evidence points to this. Trans people exist all over the world. Some of them are gay. Your level of plain denial of the simple fact of people existing is no less than stunning.

Transgendered males are homosexuals assimilating to a homophobic culture, while transbianism is a paraphilia & nb is the product of a teen sub-culture, it's clear as day. What's the alternative? "Trapped in the wrong body", feel like this, live like that? Give me a break.

It’s gender dysphoria. What’s so hard to grasp about that. You think your male body is disgusting so you did it. Bingo. It doesn’t require or rule out same sex attraction.

[–]SnowAssMan[S] 6 insightful - 1 fun6 insightful - 0 fun7 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

You still believe that a desire to be the opposite sex is a mental disorder? In the past we used to pathologise homosexuality, nowadays gender clinics are on the increase, we are clearly going in the wrong direction on that front. On the other hand, if you remember my previous post on here, international bodies are beginning to de-pathologise "gender incongruence", as they combat the Westerncentric, pathologising view that you embrace.

No, I'm not using transbian wrong. Google it.

Regarding brain structures "correlation does not prove causation". A brain structure can be as much an effect as a cause. Even you know that.

the rising number of out trans people

The economy crashed in 2008 & has yet to recover, in fact, it has taken a few more blows recently by the virus & lockdowns. Cultures become more traditionalist in the wake of an economic crash, this has been true since the agricultural revolution some 12 thousand years ago. The rise of the far-right & the coinciding of the trans trend are not unrelated. They are both symptoms of an economic disease – or so it could be argued, without contradiction. If you've noticed it's mostly the illegitimate "trans" people who are the loudest, most visible, most dogmatic & most active within the movement. They are overcompensating, which seems to be the default for trans people, generally. Reminds me of right-wing, closeted homosexual homophobes.

Literally no evidence points to this. Trans people exist all over the world. Some of them are gay. Your level of plain denial of the simple fact of people existing is no less than stunning.

Over the course of this discussion I have provided citations (granted mostly secondary, but even some primary ones) on the exclusively androphilic sexual orientations of the hijra, kathoey, muxe, fa’afafine, xanith, travesti & the maknyahs. I'm running out of transgendered males in the world to cover. You're clearly the one in denial. When are you finally going to produce any evidence to the contrary???

"Gender dysphoria" doesn't exist outside the West though, that's the problem. That's why the INTERNATIONAL Classification of Diseases had to replace it with 'gender incongruence', which isn't entirely accurate either, but it's a step in the right direction, as it's less Westerncentric & less pathologising.