GC: Do you genuinely desire to have more trans men in public positions (i.e. acting, politics)?

submitted by GenderbenderShe/her/hers from self.GCdebatesQT

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[–]SnowAssMan 15 insightful - 1 fun15 insightful - 0 fun16 insightful - 1 fun -  (6 children)

You're describing a recent phenomenon which is mainly only occurring in the West, among the middle-classes. Why would you assume that trans-men will always think of themselves as men?

There is a movie from 1999 called Boys Don't Cry about a girl who wants to pass as a man (based on a real person). At the time she was a girl, nowadays we revise history to make her a he. 1999 wasn't that long ago. In just as little time the pendulum could swing right back again. Maybe once the economy is better & people are less into conformity, then we could see a return to gender abolition instead of gender appropriation.

[–]GenderbenderShe/her/hers[S] 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (5 children)

You're describing a recent phenomenon

Trans men have existed since the beginning of time. Just for many years we haven't publically acknowledged trans people.

which is mainly only occurring in the West,

Trans men exist in 3rd world countries.

among the middle-classes.

Trans men come from all walks of life.

Why would you assume that trans-men will always think of themselves as men?

There is a movie from 1999 called Boys Don't Cry about a girl who wants to pass as a man (based on a real person). At the time she was a girl, nowadays we revise history to make her a he.

Even in the documentary, Brandon Teena openly identified as a man. It's just that back then, the media referred to trans people as "cross dressers". Nowadays the media acknowledges trans people but that only started fairly recently.

[–]MezozoicGaygay male 8 insightful - 1 fun8 insightful - 0 fun9 insightful - 1 fun -  (4 children)

When the laws were "you do house work and have no rights for education or a job" and for doing "men's" job or getting education while being poor punishment was prison or death, the only way for woman to do anything at all was to present themselves as a man and hope that lies will not be detected, to avoid prison/death. When the only way for lesbians to be together, is for one of them to present as a man. All of them were not transmen, all of them were still women, who tried to achieve at least something, or to be together with their beloved. Similar laws were almost through whole history, and even nowadays at least third of women population in the world as still living under similar laws. Just wanting to live as they want is not making them trans, it makes the society they are in - misogynic and unfair to women. Such society must be challenged with feminism. If will to live normal life and not as a slave makes them men, then what - wanting to live bad life and be subordinated is women's destiny? I don't believe in this, and I know women are as capable as men. And if the only way for young women and girls to escape hate and live normally is to "stop being a women", then it is something really wrong with society around them. Like - really, really wrong.

[–]GenderbenderShe/her/hers[S] 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (3 children)

My high school had a pants protest in the 1940s. A girl was suspended for wearing pants to school where girls could only wear skirts, so a bunch of girls showed up to school wearing pants in protest.

None of those girls ever became men. They just wanted girls to be able to wear pants in school like boys can. People should only identify as trans if they have dysphoria, not because they don’t like gender norms. There are trans guys who wear dresses, like cis guys and that’s OK. Transgenderism shouldn’t be about gender roles.

[–]CatbugMods allow rape victim blaming in this sub :) 9 insightful - 1 fun9 insightful - 0 fun10 insightful - 1 fun -  (2 children)

But it is and that’s half the problem people have with it.

[–]GenderbenderShe/her/hers[S] 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

To an extent I agree. Some people feel they are non-binary because they wear certain clothes or like certain things. I don't agree with this. You identifying as another sex shouldn't have anything to do with stereotypes or roles.

[–]CatbugMods allow rape victim blaming in this sub :) 7 insightful - 1 fun7 insightful - 0 fun8 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

Why is it ok to enforce those stereotypes if you say “I’m non binary :)”?

Why do the stereotypes become good if someone likes them?