All (mainly QT): If socialization is not a large factor than what causes drastically elevated levels of violence and sociopathic behavior in human males vs. human females?

submitted by DistantGlimmer from self.GCdebatesQT

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[–]DistantGlimmer[S] 9 insightful - 1 fun9 insightful - 0 fun10 insightful - 1 fun -  (6 children)

I have never heard anyone say that it has zero effect (and wouldn't agree on that) I do think or at least hope that it isn't the main factor determining it though. My own experience is that a lot of the negative aspects of male socialization can at least be worked on and improved even though it certainly is not as simple as many transwomen make out to get rid of it. There probably is a biological element with testosterone making men naturally more aggressive but when you look at transmen they don't suddenly become identically violent to men when they start taking testosterone so a lot of it is socialization.

[–]worried19 7 insightful - 1 fun7 insightful - 0 fun8 insightful - 1 fun -  (4 children)

Agreed. Socialization obviously plays a key role. If it were due to testosterone alone, trans men would all of a sudden display criminality at similar levels as natal men, and that just doesn't happen.

[–][deleted] 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (3 children)

There was one study that indicated increased criminality in trans men to be fair, but the author stated this was likely due to survival crime.

[–]worried19 4 insightful - 1 fun4 insightful - 0 fun5 insightful - 1 fun -  (2 children)

Interesting. I've also noticed that there seem to be more GNC women in prison than you would normally see in society at large. I wonder if there's anything about being a masculine woman that predisposes one towards behavior that might lead to trouble with the law, or if it's solely a matter of effects due to being outcast or put on the fringes of society.

If trans men engage in more survival crime, it could be due to the same reason, that they're forced into criminality by marginalization. I wonder if that study controls for education, family support, and job prospects. Who's the author of the study? It would be interesting to see if levels of criminality go up only after testosterone treatment, or if they were higher before that.

[–]VioletRemihomosexual female (aka - lesbian) 4 insightful - 1 fun4 insightful - 0 fun5 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

I've also noticed that there seem to be more GNC women in prison than you would normally see in society at large.

It has to do most likely with how criminal world works.

I remember memoirs of either japanese or chinese "criminal mother" over big criminal sindicat. And a lot of her experience was described as that you need to look less feminine, act more agressive, and have more tattoos and so on, otherwise no one will take you seriously and you will be at high risks of rape because you are dealing with honorless thugs all the time. And that being like that is also fight against the system as well, to show that you are not complying to "normal society" and fully with criminal world.

So most likely they are criminals not because they are GNC, but they are GNC because they are criminals.

[–][deleted] 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

I don’t have the name handy but it’s the Swedish study that gc often cites to say trans women maintain male criminality (even though the author notes it is different types of crimes and that the crime rate was lower in the latest observed group).

[–]VioletRemihomosexual female (aka - lesbian) 7 insightful - 1 fun7 insightful - 0 fun8 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

it certainly is not as simple as many transwomen make out

Most are not even trying, which is very sad.