Does GC feminism include trans men?

submitted by GenderbenderShe/her/hers from self.GCdebatesQT

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[–]GenderbenderShe/her/hers[S] 1 insightful - 3 fun1 insightful - 2 fun2 insightful - 3 fun -  (6 children)

You're right, some of them are girls.

I mean they aren't female, no matter what GC thinks.

As I already said, the issue is category vs individual. Trans natal males keep talking over trans natal females like men do with women. Trans natal females are mostly in the press when they get pregnant, while trans natal males are in the press for political, sport. artistic or economic successes.

GC also talks over trans men. Though I suggest listrbubg to trans men as a class before making determinations.

LOL, , no. Their sexuality stays the same: they are still attracted to men. They just change the label to validate themselves, but a straight woman doesn' t become a gay man, she becomes a straight woman who calls herself a gay man.

It does change, because straight men and lesbians are not attracted to men.

Congratulations for your bisexuality!!!!!!

I'm not bisexual. I'm attracted to MEN, like Brad Pitt, Lebron James, Buck Angel, Zac Efron. I am not attracted to women like Oprah, Megan Fox, Laverne Cox, or Jessica Alba. Take Lauren Jackson for example, the trans woman who was assaulted for using the women's bathroom. She wasn't completely transitioned, and even though age identified as a female, I can still be attracted to her. However, once she transitioned and lost her masculine features, I am no longer attracted to her. If a trans men passes and has bottom surgery I am attracted to them. If they hadn't had bottom surgery, I am still willing to do sexual things with them that don't involve their genitals. This doesn't make me bisexual, this makes me straight. If I were bisexual I would be attracted to women.

Good for them, and? You should spend your time praising them instead of whining that we are not welcoming enough if that is what you think.

I praise them, and I praise the trans movement, even if it has its issues (which it does).

[–]Omina_SentenziosaSarcastic Ovalord 10 insightful - 1 fun10 insightful - 0 fun11 insightful - 1 fun -  (5 children)

I mean they aren't female, no matter what GC thinks.

Oh, you' re one of those people who think that transitioning and/or identification changes your sex.

I don' t have the energy to waste my time trying to change your mind given that I can see you are too far gone to accept reality. I will, however, use your comments the next time someone tells me that there is no chance in hell that a trans person/TRA is dumb enough to actually think that trans people are the sex they claim to be.

GC also talks over trans men. Though I suggest listrbubg to trans men as a class before making determinations.

I have been listening to them: lots of them complain that trans natal males talk over them exactly like men talk over women.

It does change, because straight men and lesbians are not attracted to men.

No shit? But the fact that you are still attracted to the same people you were attracted to before transitioning, means that your sexual orientation didn' t change. The only thing you changed is the name you call yourself because of your sexuality, because you think you have changed sex. You haven' t, and you haven' t changed sexuality either.

I'm not bisexual. I'm attracted to MEN, like Brad Pitt, Lebron James, Buck Angel, Zac Efron.

So you are attracted to males and females who present as males.

That' s called bisexuality.

[–]GenderbenderShe/her/hers[S] 1 insightful - 3 fun1 insightful - 2 fun2 insightful - 3 fun -  (4 children)

Oh, you' re one of those people who think that transitioning and/or identification changes your sex.

I mean socially passing trans men are not treated as female, so it doesn't make sense for GC to include trans men in most of their activism. But we do acknowledge not all sex characteristics can be changed.

I have been listening to them: lots of them complain that trans natal males talk over them exactly like men talk over women.

Yes, trans women get move visibility than trans men. But trans men on r/FTM have posted anti-GC threads. Here are a few.

Gender critical finally got banned today!!!

Can we talk about how to deal with TERFs?

Why did I decide that arguing with a terf was a good idea

feeling ashamed because of things terfs accuse trans men of

Had a very unpleasant encounter with a TERF classmate who tried to “convert” me

They even use the term TERF in their title, which GC considers a slur.

No shit? But the fact that you are still attracted to the same people you were attracted to before transitioning, means that your sexual orientation didn' t change. The only thing you changed is the name you call yourself because of your sexuality, because you think you have changed sex. You haven' t, and you haven' t changed sexuality either.

Yes it's the label for your sexual orientation that changes. As a straight woman I will tell you I'm attracted to pre-transition trans women but not post-transition trans women. This will depend on how far into transition they are.

So you are attracted to males and females who present as males.

That' s called bisexuality.

That's called heterosexuality. Aren't most people attracted to gender presentation?

[–]worried19 7 insightful - 1 fun7 insightful - 0 fun8 insightful - 1 fun -  (3 children)

That's called heterosexuality. Aren't most people attracted to gender presentation?

I don't get this viewpoint. Is my male partner gay or bisexual because I have a masculine gender presentation? Or do you think there need to be hormones involved?

[–]VioletRemihomosexual female (aka - lesbian) 5 insightful - 3 fun5 insightful - 2 fun6 insightful - 3 fun -  (2 children)

Yeah, this will mean that other people sexual orientation depends on you. And not on them. And this means that sexual orientation can be changed, which is false.

[–]worried19 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

It doesn't make sense from a logical standpoint. If a man dates a woman, and she's feminine, then he's straight, but if she changes up her appearance and becomes GNC, then all of a sudden he's gay or bisexual? It doesn't work like that. Nothing has materially changed in either case. She still has a female body.

[–]VioletRemihomosexual female (aka - lesbian) 5 insightful - 5 fun5 insightful - 4 fun6 insightful - 5 fun -  (0 children)

You don't understand, girl. I am floating-gender, so my gender is different every day.

Yesterday I was wearing pink dress, so I was a woman, so my girlfriend was a lesbian.

Today I am wearing black pants, so I am a man, so my girlfriend is straight now.

Tomorrow I am planning to be demigender and wear rainbow-colored paranja, so my girlfriend will be pansexual.

As easy as that!

Is it clear that it is obvious sarcasm, or should I add /s because in today's political climate someone can say this seriously?