How can I put my trust in Jesus knowing he was a dirty Jew?

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[–]Dragonerne 4 insightful - 1 fun4 insightful - 0 fun5 insightful - 1 fun -  (19 children)

Jesus wasn't a jew. He was a judean.

[–][deleted] 3 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 0 fun4 insightful - 1 fun -  (15 children)

Jesus wasn't a jew. He was a judean fictional character.

Fixed that for you.

[–][deleted] 3 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 0 fun4 insightful - 1 fun -  (14 children)

Jesus wasn't a jew. He was a judean fictional character.

Possibly fictional, but references to him by Josephus and others, combined with a lack of any credible denials of his existence by groups it would benefit make me inclined to bet that he probably existed. Now I don't think he was born to a virgin or resurrected or any other such obviously syncretic mythology with a much earlier origin than Jesus, but I'm inclined to believe there was probably a religious leader amongst the commoners that these myths are based on.

Some guy said he was the chosen one and called himself 'the christ', and acquired a following in a particular area (Israel)at a particular time in history (about 2k years ago). There really isnt much here for me to be incredulous about, sounds like pretty typical human history

The part I'm incredulous about is basing your entire worldview on the idea that these myths are literally true 2000 years later

[–][deleted] 4 insightful - 1 fun4 insightful - 0 fun5 insightful - 1 fun -  (3 children)

It may be plausible, although all writings by humans should be considered questionable. Norse, Greek, Egyptian and Hindu religions speak of hundreds of divine figures, how do we determine the validity of each? If it is my other written witness of the time, then we should have to consider the existence of many other individuals through ancient history that shed doubt upon the common pop-religions of today.

[–][deleted] 4 insightful - 1 fun4 insightful - 0 fun5 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

Norse, Greek, Egyptian and Hindu religions speak of hundreds of divine figures, how do we determine the validity of each?

I don't think there are any 'valid' divine figures. I regard any christian accounts of Jesus to be mythical, I just think it likely these myths were based on a historical figure. This isnt uncommon, Egyptian pharaohs were thought to be divine, which is absurd, but I wouldn't claim the pharaohs didnt exist historically, clearly they did, and claimed to be divine as many people have throughout the course of human history

[–][deleted] 4 insightful - 1 fun4 insightful - 0 fun5 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

Ah, fair assessment. I agree this likely to be the case.

[–]Vulptex 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

I think the gnostics had it right. Not the bizarro ones but those who recognized the sad state of the world and how it's run by malevolent entities.

[–]jet199 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (3 children)

The reference by Josephus was clearly inserted later.

There are no good contemporary references for Jesus existing.

[–][deleted] 3 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 0 fun4 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

If Jesus were completely a fabricated individual, I would expect that Jews in particular would have and would still vocally denounce Jesus as a non-historical figure. The fact that the Jews deny his divinity but not his existence during this time doesn't seem to support this. The idea that some person in a highly religious region in an era of superstition would declare themselves divine, and acquire a following that made up mythical stories to glorify them doesn't seem even remotely implausible given human history

[–]jet199 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

Loads of people did it.

But there's still not one historical Jesus you can pin down.

[–]Vulptex 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

There are also no good contemporary references for the vast majority of people who existed back then.

[–]Vulptex 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (5 children)

Most historians think the Josephus reference is an interpolation by Christians in the middle ages, and possibly the one on John the Baptist too.

[–][deleted] 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (2 children)

Most historians think the Josephus reference is an interpolation by Christians in the middle ages, and possibly the one on John the Baptist too.

Could be.

I'll just say that with the limited knowledge we have, it seems far more likely that there was some religious guy in Israel around 2000 years ago that amassed a following, and those followers told/wrote myths about him in passing on his teachings, than some conspiracy where people completely fabricated his existence

[–]Vulptex 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

I find it more likely that a lot of the "myths" are true. He makes way too much sense for a human.

[–][deleted] 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

Maybe some of them are, but others are clearly syncretically borrowed from the earlier legends of other religions (which is also quite common, the old testament is a rip off of the epic of gilgamesh written by the Jews during exile).

Virgin birth with visit from 3 magi, resurrection after three days, the association of christmas with the winter solstice, pretty much everything about easter (based on the pagan Oestara) and many other legends are borrowed down to the minute detail, making it very hard for me to believe these are historically accurate depictions of Jesus rather than a run of the mill instance of syncretism

[–]Dragonerne 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

Jews claiming Jesus wasn't real? No way!

[–]Vulptex 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

They're not all Jewish.

[–]Vulptex 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (2 children)

He was definitely in a branch of Judaism. However it was much more diverse back then, for the most part only the Christians and rabbinical Pharisees have survived into modern times.

[–]Dragonerne 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

He was a Christian. Judaism was created much later

Your entire understanding of christianity has been subverted by satanic "jewish" liars

[–]Vulptex 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

What were the Pharisees then?