Saiditors, I've debated what "science" means with one who's allegedly superior with "psience", and others on defining "socialism". I present this matter forward for your feedback on these two processes. If I'm wrong I'll apologize and learn, or they will learn and maybe finally shut up.

submitted by JasonCarswell from (self.AskSaidIt)

Help! I'm stupid and I can't shut up!

I apologize for making you read through these comments.

Exhibit A comment section:
/s/CriticalThoughts/comments/3ued/iraq_was_preemptively_destroyed_as_a_potential/

Note the Psience linked: http://www.revolutiondesprit.com/

Exhibit B comment section:
/s/conspiracy/comments/3w8j/canadian_gov_wants_to_make_conspiracy_theories/

Exhibit C comment section:
/s/LateStageCapitalism/comments/3xj3/the_evils_of_socialism/

There may be more, but honestly this tedious shit is exhausting.

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[–]Tom_Bombadil 4 insightful - 3 fun4 insightful - 2 fun5 insightful - 3 fun -  (4 children)

Socialism is a political term that had been propagandized in the extreme.

At this point it means many different things at the same time. This makes it a loaded term which is certain to be misunderstood/misinterpreted by the audience, and probably to the speaker/writer.

The same can be said about democracy. Most people live the majority of their waking hours working in someone else's private corporate dictatorship.
Yet they believe they live in a free society. Free for whom...?

The schemers in the West managed to sabotage the concept of socialism by propaganda; mostly by cognitively linking it to the oppressive systems in the East.

In the East, the idea of socialism was used as a populist veneer to put a positive spin on yet another form of top-down tyranny.

The original goal of western social-capitalism was to recover some individual rights/dignity from the corporate masters. It was intended to be implemented as a democratic, lateral structure.

Unfortunately, it was corporatized and corrupted by many different influences. Union bosses, and organized criminal groups, etc.
This also served the aligned interests of the corporate owners.

[–]JasonCarswell[S] 2 insightful - 4 fun2 insightful - 3 fun3 insightful - 4 fun -  (2 children)

Thanks so much Tom. I wished more people had weighed in, but maybe /u/Horrux and /u/DffrntDrmmr can learn on their own that both socialism and science are processes, not fixed nouns.

Indeed, democracy can also be the tyranny of the many. You could even argue that in this post I'm trying to bring the many to be tyrants upon these guys until they groupthink properly.

I agree with your socialism outline, including the bit about top-down tyranny. Most folks don't even recognize the 3rd form of socialism, the lateral structure in worker coops, in part because the concept has been kept out of all the propaganda and public discussions.

[–][deleted] 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

No, both are fixed nouns AND processes. I feel sorry for you that you keep flaunting your mind's limitations as if they were absolute truths and qualities to admire.

But it was ever thus.

[–]JasonCarswell[S] 2 insightful - 3 fun2 insightful - 2 fun3 insightful - 3 fun -  (0 children)

Whatev.

[–][deleted] 2 insightful - 2 fun2 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 2 fun -  (0 children)

Ah, Tom understands. Finally ONE GUY has it right. Besides me of course.

[–]Tom_Bombadil 2 insightful - 2 fun2 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 2 fun -  (3 children)

I didn't open the links, but I'm going to shoot from the hip.

Science had become a religion where people who don't understand how it works take it as gospel. It's true until it's proven false, so plenty of "cutting edge science" is crap.
It's waiting to be disproven.

It depends upon the field. Many have been corrupted/captured

Social sciences = propaganda.
Medical/ biological sciences = corporate profits.
Theoretical/particle physics = occult mysticism.
Climate sciences modelers = pseudoscience/propaganda. I believed man made global warning was real for most of my life. They fooled me in school as a child. Propaganda.

The same predictions of doom in 10 years, for over 30 years.

[–]JasonCarswell[S] 2 insightful - 3 fun2 insightful - 2 fun3 insightful - 3 fun -  (2 children)

Waking up to the Climate Change scam was the most difficult truth for me to come around on, by far. (Next hardest was the Holocaust and actually looking into the "Nazi" counter-narrative, which now seems so obvious, but I was afraid to look.)

I agree with everything you said on a basic skeptic level, though I find it more than a little one sided and extreme. To me science can be used for good and bad, so some medicine is good, and some not. Particle physics the same. Space is fascinating, but NASA has a dark side too.

I didn't phrase my request specifically enough, but I was looking for more of a comparison between faith in corporate scientism and transparent skepticism with open-science, and/or, something about the scientific method and the necessity to be able to refute it all, and that every experiment must be repeatable and the accumulation of failures ultimately lead to the truth that remains. At least, that's what I think the discussion was about. To be honest, now I just don't care. He's free to wallow in ignorance clear of me.

[–]Tom_Bombadil 2 insightful - 2 fun2 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 2 fun -  (1 child)

sciencism has been part of the oligarchs plan for some time now.

It boils down to experts/scientists (modern priest class) telling the public what to think.

The priest class was controlled by whomever ruled at the time, in the same way. The obedient priests were promoted to positions of power. Honest and decent priests were marginalized.

The same basics apply to modern academia.
Publish climate change fraud, or create deleterious vaccines and you'll be given awards, and asked to speak at academic conferences, publish articles, etc.
Publish scientifically legitimate climate science, or vaccine safety concerns and you're defunded, and made into a pariah.

[–]JasonCarswell[S] 2 insightful - 3 fun2 insightful - 2 fun3 insightful - 3 fun -  (0 children)

Agreed.

Some guy in his garage can prove them wrong and be utterly ignored, suppressed, patents stolen by military or gov, or simply rubbed out. Science has sold out for the most part. All the Universities, think tanks, etc are bought and sold. Open-science is a rarity - yet it exists as a movement and I really hope it grows.

It's pretty much as illustrated by the "In Shadow" animated short.

[–]JasonCarswell[S] 1 insightful - 3 fun1 insightful - 2 fun2 insightful - 3 fun -  (0 children)

Feel free to define "science" as you see it.

[–]JasonCarswell[S] 1 insightful - 3 fun1 insightful - 2 fun2 insightful - 3 fun -  (0 children)

Feel free to define "socialism" as you see it.