The education system is inherently corrupt.

submitted by CarlDung from self.200acres

Not because they teach historical revisionism and leftist propaganda, but because there's no underlying system how one should behave in a civil society. One of the biggest difference between US, Europe and places like Japan, Singapore, China and to some extend S.Korea does, is something called character education -wiki.

Interestingly, it is only mentioned that it is used to teach solidarity and tolerance. On the contrary, it is historically something which attunes people to receive and adopt nationalistic behavior which in turn translates into greater social cohesion and productivity.

Modern schools teach historical wrongdoings, individualism, self-hate, consumerism and similar values embedded in all subjects they deem objective.

Before reddit ban, I started to make a research about old academic subjects. Before second world war it was common to e.g. study differences and characteristics of different peoples. This discipline was called ethnology, and research made within this subject will provide useful in understanding the modern world. There are hidden rules for different types of cultures, ethnic compositions, generational differences which are unacknowledged, and because there's no attention directed to these issues, our societies are falling apart.

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[–]christine_grab 5 insightful - 1 fun5 insightful - 0 fun6 insightful - 1 fun -  (18 children)

I am Gen X. I have heard that my generation is the last cohesive generation because we were little in the days of monoculture. As we grew, things like cable took off, offering a multitude of choices for TV shows. When I was little, there were only a handful of channels to choose from and most of us watched the same shows. Same goes for education. That is when alternative schooling programs, like magnet schools, started to take root. But I am not sure that mono-culture is a good thing. I think they should be teaching accurate history from multiple-view points so people understand nuance in the shaping of history and evolution of our culture, not make sure everyone is programmed the same via ethnoculture classes.

[–]CarlDung[S] 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (17 children)

I have heard that my generation is the last cohesive generation because we were little in the days of monoculture.

Sounds plausible!

But I am not sure that mono-culture is a good thing. I think they should be teaching accurate history from multiple-view points so people understand nuance in the shaping of history and evolution of our culture, not make sure everyone is programmed the same via ethnoculture classes.

I see your point. The problem which might occur with variety of interpretations gives a leeway for cultural deviation. It might be sub-culture, it might be youth culture, it might be anything. These deviations are always something which struggle against the official narrative. People can and will have their own ideas about certain events, but it serves no purpose in the long run to question the official narrative.

If people begin to question whether e.g. government is any good, will decrease the trust towards the government, the tax system, and gives a reason to sympathetize with criminals, tax evaders etc. This development decreases social trust, and makes people to rely more on things which still have an universal value.

Mono-culture is the standard form of political structure, meanwhile deviations are acts of subversion done either by foreign agents or people who excercise free will. The nation is in its most eqalitarian state when there's a singular understanding of wellbeing, good life, moral values and so on. Deviations undermine the governments capabilities to realize those ideals, and different views on e.g. "good life" obfuscate how the success of state functions can be measured.

If there's a chance, always choose monoculture before multiculture.

[–]christine_grab 3 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 0 fun4 insightful - 1 fun -  (16 children)

I think you have made this blogger's point for her: https://caitlinjohnstone.com/2018/09/04/how-to-own-life-like-a-fucking-wizard/

It sounds like your definition of peace is keeping the narrative tightly controlled so that people are brainwashed by the false societal narrative of the ruling class. She says that we need to shed the false narrative and create one that helps all of us in society flourish. Where we are at right now is that the ruling class has lost control of the societal narrative and there is a clash between the people who have an accurate narrative, the ruling powers trying to force the false narrative down our throats, and a whole lot of confused people who know things aren't right in our world right now, but have no clue that the war we are fighting is actually a war of who controls the societal narrative.

[–]CarlDung[S] 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (15 children)

It sounds like your definition of peace is keeping the narrative tightly controlled so that people are brainwashed by the false societal narrative of the ruling class.

Criticizing everything is not a good foundation for society.

She says that we need to shed the false narrative and create one that helps all of us in society flourish.

After deciding what's good for you, stick to it. Isn't that what monoculture is about?

[–]christine_grab 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (14 children)

No, it's about each one of us deciding to make ourselves better people and calling out others when they aren't being fair. The controlling societal narrative should be decided as a collective based on what is good for the whole population and planet. Both historically and currently, society has been all about one group getting into power and exploiting everyone else via that power. They convince the masses to give them this power via the narrative they have constructed. Currently, BLM and ANTIFA are trying to grab the power. While they make many valid points, the majority of their narrative simply isn't accurate -- all white people are not evil who deserve to be exploited. They have made it clear via their narrative their intention is to take power by force are then exploit everyone outside their group. Both of these factions have stated that they intend to rule in the same manner as every other group who has come into power. We need to break that cycle of power grab/exploitation.

Your argument is that a strong narrative control = calm society, but that is not true. Pretending that a cohesive narrative exists doesn't change the reality of the suffering of the people being exploited by the narrative creators. I am a perfect example of this because I am currently fighting back against false government narrative.

I caught the State of CA red-handed running two racketeering schemes: https://saidit.net/s/corruption/comments/2usv/i_have_uncovered_government_corruption_in/ They have been able to get away with it for YEARS via careful narrative control. As you will see in this 11-minute speech I made to the State Controller, I called them out on their bull shit false narrative. The State waived their right of rebuttal, which is a tacit admission of guilt: https://gwsandiego.net/blog/?p=179 While I haven't gotten them to stop the racketeering schemes as of yet. I certainly have made great progress in getting them to change their narrative to be more in line with reality. They added the our principals, our values and our goals section to this webpage as a result of my complaints. They also added this page to their website as a result of my complaints: https://www.ftb.ca.gov/help/disagree-or-resolve-an-issue/taxpayer-advocate-services.html, and they added a few other things, too.

According to your argument, I should have rolled over and let them continue the racketeering scheme because you want them to be allowed to completely control the narrative, even if it is detrimental to me and every other person in CA. No thank you. I want the narrative to reflect reality as it is and I will not stop pushing for that. I have already succeeded in making CA a better place for every taxpayer and I will keep pushing until our government's narrative is in a good place.

[–]CarlDung[S] 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (13 children)

No, it's about each one of us deciding to make ourselves better people and calling out others when they aren't being fair.

That sounds a lot like anarchy, and I'm honestly not really convinced it would work in practice.

The controlling societal narrative should be decided as a collective based on what is good for the whole population and planet.

Agreed, but shouldn't there be some restrictions? I can't remember was it Aristotle or Plato who said the problem with democracy is that every good decision requires good judgement, and without developing this sense of good judgement, people would just do bad decision as a collective. The thing is, the few exceptional individuals will drown in the sea of the mindless.

Both historically and currently, society has been all about one group getting into power and exploiting everyone else via that power. They convince the masses to give them this power via the narrative they have constructed.

True, albeit there are better and worse "masters". For me it is hard to see what is the productive outcome of radical emancipation, because that's like theoretical impossibility. People are different, some people just like money for the sake of it, some people just work enough to buy some random things they like to do on their spare time.

Your argument is that a strong narrative control = calm society, but that is not true. Pretending that a cohesive narrative exists doesn't change the reality of the suffering of the people being exploited by the narrative creators. I am a perfect example of this because I am currently fighting back against false government narrative.

One of my friends used to ship CRT-screens and other old electronics to Africa some 20 years ago. At some point, it turned out that people didn't want crt-screens after they had learned about flat screens. It is the same thing with with exploitation. Some people are self sufficient in deciding what's good for them, but some people have to adjust their happiness with the wellbeing of others. I personally don't feel rich, but if I had to compare my life with someone who lives in Africa, I might be.

I mean, how do you decide someone is suffering? How do you assess that someone is no longer exploited? If it is something people can decide for themselves, I'll promise it won't never end.

...racketeering schemes

Governments are as good as the people of the nation, and getting rid of the government just switches the problems of corruption into problems which come with lawlessness and anarchy. You know, originally people had the problem with a catholic church. They said they just confiscate church taxes into their own coffers while holding some perverted occult ceremonies in secret hideouts or whatever. Then the reformation came, and people thought everything would be better. Well, the aristocrats confiscated most of the church properties, and many Nordic states decided to choose reformation, because it gave them lots of extra funds to use. After a while people realized it was not the church which was corrupt, but the aristocrats, nobility, kings and queens etc.

Some people truly thought they would get away with all the problems they associated with monarchy, corrupt bailiffs, power hungry barons etc. Some people believed the society would be better, and more egalitarian with the introduction of democratic system. Now then, people are attacking the police, officials, they say stuff like "anarchy is the answer" or killing off white people would somehow improve their lives. People just don't get it, the power structures are always amalgamation of the central ideas, albeit the average of those. If the societal cohesion is lacking, the officials think for themselves, instead of the good of the nation. This is the problem of multicultural societies, everyone starts to think for themselves, and think this is somehow good. The problem lies in the people, and the deviant behavior they somehow tout as a progress to some direction without understanding that with every structural change their problems have only taken a different form, as the problem was never in the structure, but instead, it is always the people.

[–]christine_grab 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (9 children)

The problem lies in the people, and the deviant behavior they somehow tout as a progress to some direction without understanding that with every structural change their problems have only taken a different form, as the problem was never in the structure, but instead, it is always the people.

Correct. As I said above, usually its one group of power-hungry people throwing out the existing group in power and setting up the same basic type of system of control via manipulation that is executed by false narrative. People need to learn to identify false narratives and manipulation. Maybe those are things we can teach in school?

Your Catholic Church example was great. Basically, you said clearly that historically, society rewards wealth. Over time, different manipulators changed the societal narrative to steal the power and then hoarded the power and wealth for themselves. But you basically said they should have stuck with the original corruption of the Catholic Church and never should have changed it in the first place. The reason it changed each time was because that societal narrative wasn't working for the masses and they all agreed to a new narrative that they hoped would work better for them. It didn't but that is because the narrative-makers were self-serving. We need to stop rewarding manipulators with wealth. And in those days, it was very easy for TPTB to control the narrative, yet they couldn't keep up the false narrative forever.

Going to stick to the examples currently happening in the US: ANTIFA and BLM are both spouting false narratives. The color of your body suit has no bearing on your character, for better or worse, and is thus a false narrative. Violence is a violation of the sovereignty of others and is reprehensible in all forms. Saying violence is ok for the sake of protest is a false narrative. Everyone who supports these movements has been duped by the false narratives. If I understand where your point of view is coming from, this is what you mean by counter-culture, correct? A narrative different than the main societal narrative, but not necessarily any more true (and possibly demonstrably less true) than the official societal narrative?

The truth is that in the current economic system, the rich are hoarding all the resources to the detriment of the masses, and as a society, we need to change the way money distribution works. Maybe we need to change the way money works altogether since fiat currency is dubious. That is the truth that TPTB are trying to keep covered up. They know that the money system only is in place because we as a society have agreed to it, and we can stop agreeing at any moment. The MSM and many corporations seems to support these false BLM and ANTIFA narratives, which makes it appear that the current group in power are grabbing on to a new angle with which to hold power since their current narrative is rapidly disintegrating with the light of truth shined on it from social media and alternative journalism. Hence the mass banning we are seeing now on Twitter, FB and Reddit.

But things like communism simply move the wealth from private to government, giving those in the government all the power to exploit the same as the private owners did before them. Switching from one exploitative system to another does no one any good.

The solution is to 1. stop rewarding manipulators with wealth 2. educate people better they have better discernment skills to spot false narratives and manipulation. 3. Then there will be more people like me, who go after the existing government legally and peacefully in order to change it so it serves the people instead of exploits the people. With more people pushing on the government to force them to operate openly and fairly, things will just naturally improve.

[–]CarlDung[S] 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (8 children)

Correct. As I said above, usually its one group of power-hungry people throwing out the existing group in power and setting up the same basic type of system of control via manipulation that is executed by false narrative. People need to learn to identify false narratives and manipulation. Maybe those are things we can teach in school?

Well, people might figure out what is best for them, but there's no guarantee it will work in the large scale. Nobody is educated enough to fix the big picture, and this is the reason we still need a bigger structure, because there will always be states which punish their neighbors for not being competitive enough either economically or having a capable military to defend themselves. This goes into geopolitcs, but it is another topic I guess.

Your Catholic Church example was great. Basically, you said clearly that historically, society rewards wealth. Over time, different manipulators changed the societal narrative to steal the power and then hoarded the power and wealth for themselves. But you basically said they should have stuck with the original corruption of the Catholic Church and never should have changed it in the first place.

Few centuries ago (—something between 300 to 400 years) Jean-Jacques Rousseau was working with some corrupt bureaucracts in the border customs, and he thought the idea of nationalism would fix everything, as they would switch their loyalties from their own bosses / authorities to the people. Practically it meant to switch loyalties from the French crown to the French people i.e. having monoculture, instead of two hierarchies where aristocrats had their own concept of good and where masses had their own.

The reason it changed each time was because that societal narrative wasn't working for the masses and they all agreed to a new narrative that they hoped would work better for them. It didn't but that is because the narrative-makers were self-serving. We need to stop rewarding manipulators with wealth. And in those days, it was very easy for TPTB to control the narrative, yet they couldn't keep up the false narrative forever.

This is really hard to fix, because some people are always better than others in playing the system for their own benefit.

If I understand where your point of view is coming from, this is what you mean by counter-culture, correct? A narrative different than the main societal narrative, but not necessarily any more true (and possibly demonstrably less true) than the official societal narrative?

Yes, corrrect.

The truth is that in the current economic system, the rich are hoarding all the resources to the detriment of the masses, and as a society, we need to change the way money distribution works. ... The MSM and many corporations seems to support these false BLM and ANTIFA narratives, which makes it appear that the current group in power are grabbing on to a new angle with which to hold power since their current narrative is rapidly disintegrating with the light of truth shined on it from social media and alternative journalism. Hence the mass banning we are seeing now on Twitter, FB and Reddit.

True, the narrative—at least for me seems to point towards "divide and conquer" style of politics. I don't think it will work on the long run, but they might go with is because there's no better alternatives, or they are just going with it to adjust their internal structure for the imminent fallout.

But things like communism simply move the wealth from private to government, giving those in the government all the power to exploit the same as the private owners did before them. Switching from one exploitative system to another does no one any good.

True.

The solution is to 1. stop rewarding manipulators with wealth 2. educate people better they have better discernment skills to spot false narratives and manipulation. 3. Then there will be more people like me, who go after the existing government legally and peacefully in order to change it so it serves the people instead of exploits the people. With more people pushing on the government to force them to operate openly and fairly, things will just naturally improve.

This is tricky, because e.g. without criminals, there would be no need for police, but after creating a police force, you'll eventually have police officers who incidentally exploit their position of power. We therefore return to the end of my last comment, it is the problems within the people, which could be dealt with various ways. Some people might be deterred for doing criminal acts by the fear of punishment, but some people become criminals just despite it. Some people might think they'll never get caught, so educating them might be a lost cause if they are not intelligent enough, or lack the mental faculties to become better persons.

[–]christine_grab 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (5 children)

You make excellent points. I believe that the current system rewards sociopathy. Sociopaths like Bill Gates will do ruthlessly unfair things, like stealing other people's technology and monopolistic business practices, to grab on to power and wealth. They then use that power and wealth to exploit resources/people on bigger and bigger scales. With Bill, it started in one sector, tech, and he progressively spread out into other sectors -- now he is literally trying to take over the whole world with his COVID-19 vaccine. And how many millions of people idolize Bill Gates as a hero simply because he is wealthy and created an empire?

We need to identify effective ways to identify and stop these sociopathic behaviors before the sociopath becomes an all-powerful oligarch. Once sociopathy is no longer highly rewarded, people may not desire to emulate people like Gates. We also need to figure out a new system of distributing money/resources. And I don't mean by socialism... I have been thinking maybe we should get rid of the minimum wage so that small business can afford to compete in the marketplace and make a pay cap of the highest paid person in a company can only make 20X more than the lowest paid person? So say, Aetna can no longer pay a janitor $15 and hour while the CEO makes $1,900 per hour. I admit, I need to put a lot more thought into revamping how money/resources fairly works.

We also need to stop the manipulators from encouraging criminal activity. Here is a relevant video on that topic: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=26ORPuH1-rU&feature=share. If you are like me and don't like to watch videos, here is the text that the rap star reads/comments on in the video: https://www.reddit.com/r/conspiracy/comments/hdfm30/the_secret_meeting_that_changed_rap_music_and/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=ios_app&utm_name=iossmf. Back to my BLM/Antifa analogy, we're seeing a lot of criminal activity being glorified right now (ie looting and rioting) and it is deeply disturbing. We need to get the BLM/Antifa supporters to understand that TPTB are manipulating them to be pawns in a bigger agenda.

But back to the original discussion that started this very interesting and thought provoking thread... I think it is too late to go back to the days of monoculture. With the internet, it is just too easy for information that goes against the official narrative to be uploaded and shared. We have to accept that things are moving forward in a new way, embrace the new way, and try to utilize it for the greater good.

Thank you so much for this discussion. I have thoroughly enjoyed it :)

[–]CarlDung[S] 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (4 children)

I believe that the current system rewards sociopathy.

That's true. Every era and society has rewarded different kind of people. I've always found it funny how deeply primitive we are in this sense. I mean, even when we want to tell ourselves how civilized we are, the most common form of dealing with injustice in our entertainment industry is to teach how physical demonstrations of strength will fix everything. Batman fixes organized crime by beating them up. Marvel superheroes beat up whatever seems to be threatening the order.

With Bill, it started in one sector, tech, and he progressively spread out into other sectors -- now he is literally trying to take over the whole world with his COVID-19 vaccine.

I'm not familiar with this, but I'll try to research this topic later.

We also need to figure out a new system of distributing money/resources. And I don't mean by socialism... I have been thinking maybe we should get rid of the minimum wage so that small business can afford to compete in the marketplace and make a pay cap of the highest paid person in a company can only make 20X more than the lowest paid person?

It feels weird, but we had this same issue a bit over a hundred years ago. Back then the ideas which were thrown around were communism or capitalism, and then those who advocated for "third way" i.e. something in between, which was usually distributism, social corporatism or fascism. I was once really interested about distributism, because it emphasizes the the spiritual aspect of wellbeing a lot.

But back to the original discussion that started this very interesting and thought provoking thread... I think it is too late to go back to the days of monoculture.

Well, before the national cultures of french, german, italian etc. there were other cultures. Usually people forget their culture when it doesn't offer anything for them, or when their culture becomes too impractical guideline to function properly in this world. Just like we are discussing about government structures. When the ruling culture has failed to integrate individuals to follow its founding principles, people tend to invent a new one. Sometimes these cultures take the form of political parties, and such thing happened e.g. in Russia, they truly tried to eradicate everything during the communist era that somehow reminded them of the time of Russian monarchy ruled by Tsar.

I personally believe cultures have a certain kind of lifecycles, which either can be rejuvenated with every new generation, or they can be denied by big catastrophes which shake down the old order. Founding a new structure takes a lot of energy, and revolutions are not always peaceful, and this is the reason why I don't necessarily like multiculturalism, it creates unnecessary uncertainty and ethnic as well as cultural tensions.

Thank you so much for this discussion. I have thoroughly enjoyed it :)

Yeah, and thank's for you too! I has been really interesting talk!

[–]christine_grab 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

Sorry, I forgot to address an important point that you made:

Well, people might figure out what is best for them, but there's no guarantee it will work in the large scale. Nobody is educated enough to fix the big picture, and this is the reason we still need a bigger structure, because there will always be states which punish their neighbors for not being competitive enough either economically or having a capable military to defend themselves. This goes into geopolitcs, but it is another topic I guess.

My thinking may on this topic may be flawed and I am very open to feedback. But my current thought process is that the fortress of control by TPTB looks big and imposing, but it is made of hollow bricks that can be pushed over with enough effort. It's all one big wall, even on an international level because the same exploitative companies are in many countries. I am pushing on one small piece of wall with the CA income tax agency, and I am trusting that other people are also pushing on other parts of the wall, even if they are too far away for me to see. I think if each one of us focuses on one issue that needs fixing -- preferably the smaller local issues at first, then there will be a lot of gaps in the wall and the wall will be so weak that it will eventually collapse. But meanwhile, if we focus on fixing things from the local level and progress upwards, we'll have a lot more success in creating a functional system than starting at the top and trying to work our way down. Does that make any sense?

[–]CarlDung[S] 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

I understand your point, and I've thought about this sometimes. For me it is hard to say what should be done, or what is the original cause of these issues. Personally I tend to favor monoculture and ethical education, because good people can make the best out of bad situations, while bad people can ruin even best situations.

we'll have a lot more success in creating a functional system than starting at the top and trying to work our way down. Does that make any sense?

Yeah, it does make sense.

[–]christine_grab 1 insightful - 1 fun1 insightful - 0 fun2 insightful - 1 fun -  (2 children)

I wanted to add one more thing that we need to educate people on in school: sovereignty. We touch on it a bit with the concept of my rights end where they infringe on your rights, but Americans seem to think that only applies to other individual Americans in select settings and and not understand how the concept applies to society at large. If Americans understood the concept of sovereignty, we would not stand by and allow wars of regime change. There is no way to morally justify bombing or starvation sanctions because we don't like the way another group has chosen to rule over themselves. Those nations are sovereign and can do whatever they want as long as the people within the nation allow it.

[–]CarlDung[S] 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (1 child)

That is a noble creed, but how would that apply to global corporations which defy the legalities and culture of one country? Some countries wouldn't care if they exploit their own people, and by buying their stuff would compromise local businesses which have to pay a living wage for their own workers. To be sure, nations would require to turn into protectionist autarky, which was the common economic policy long time ago. I might be exaggerating a lot, but this is just how it looks from my perspective.

[–]christine_grab 2 insightful - 1 fun2 insightful - 0 fun3 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

I don't think your exaggerating. The reason globalism has succeeded in destroying the Earth is because companies that exploit people/resources simply move to whichever country will allow them to do the most exploiting for profit. The key is to get the people within each of these countries to stand up to the corruption and say "No more."

[–]send_nasty_stuff 3 insightful - 1 fun3 insightful - 0 fun4 insightful - 1 fun -  (0 children)

It's not an accident that our elites have designed schools with these seemingly aimless goals. They don't put their children in institutions such as these. We are essentially already living in a society totally taken over by our enemy.

https://i0.wp.com/nationofodin.org/wp-content/uploads/2016/08/religion-odinism-enemy.jpg